If you were a koi judge...
  • HDCuHDCu May 2013
    Posts: 1,117
    Here's a hypothetical question, you got to become a koi judge in a prestigious koi show in Japan and you were judging just two kois for GC.

    Koi A had a slightly superior body, skin quality and pattern than koi B but koi A already had a deformity(in this case a slight noticeable bent body). Both had almost the same size in the jumbo category. Which would you be your pick and why?

    Post edited by HDCu at 2013-05-31 09:06:53 pm
  • ShukriShukri May 2013
    Posts: 4,881
    Bent body is a major flaw.......... thus Koi B will be the one for GC.
    In Koianswers Forum, no one individual is above the rest. This is the Forum for the Koi Community.
  • HDCuHDCu May 2013
    Posts: 1,117
    Bro Shukri,

    Are you saying that there were no kois with a slight bent body in Japan that got GC?
  • ShukriShukri May 2013
    Posts: 4,881
    Bro, you ask a hypothetical question if I were a koi judge in a prestigous koi show in Japan, and I am judging just two kois for GC. And you gave me the scenario, and you ask me which one will I pick and why?

    And I just did that.................... I pick and my reason why!!!

    And I did not say, 'Are you saying that there were no kois with a slight bent body in Japan that got GC?'
    In Koianswers Forum, no one individual is above the rest. This is the Forum for the Koi Community.
  • HDCuHDCu May 2013
    Posts: 1,117
    im just asking a follow up question whether japanese judges see also slight bent bodies as major faults in the first place or would overall quality would be overide the defect.

    does this koi have a slight bent body? i studied numerous videos and pictures and I am of the opinion that this koi has a slight bent body. any comments?
    Post edited by HDCu at 2013-05-31 10:26:42 pm
  • grinkz01grinkz01 May 2013
    Posts: 530
    i second shukri decision....bro hdcu in yours scenario it's very black&white so easy to decide which one shall be the GC.

    but in ajns 2012 gc i didnt see bent. if u spot on right side tummy as bent...this isn't a fault as it may probably due to egg but doesnt give any bad impression to overall appearance.

    in other words i might need electron microscop to zoom its fault / bent which definitely i will not do it if i am the judge at live koi show.

    Post edited by grinkz01 at 2013-05-31 11:19:59 pm
  • HDCuHDCu June 2013
    Posts: 1,117
  • smokersmoker June 2013
    Posts: 715
    Bro HDCu,
    I have no experience and too little knowledge to give a proper answer.
    So allow me to chip in base on my very personal opinion.

    Agree with Bro Ming, I also think the question is too simple, too black and white, and base on the question, the answer will be a bit paradox, if not certain.

    How slight is the slight?
    How slight is the superior?
    Many factors play in this case, and surely showing the pictures of samples to judge will help alot to give a more comprehensive answer.

    I believe in overall quality however.
    About Dainichi Showa GC AJNS 2012, I'm not sure if she can be called bent.
    However, the competitor, the Sakai Kohaku 95cm was a monster, the quality was very high.
    It was a close competition, and in a case like this, luck and taste plays their parts.
    If i'm not mistaken, one of the factors why the sakai kohaku lost, was the wound she got on her back, prior to the show.

    Personally, as much as i love that Sakai kohaku, i will choose the Dainichi Showa, for me, it's the best showa ever till date, better than the legendaries, 1991 GC Inazuma showa, 2007 GC Sakura Dainichi and 2009 GC Yamatoya Showa.

    www.koianswers.com/discussion/download/13013/GC Showa 85cm 6yo owned by Takagi bred by Dainichi Koi Farm_2.jpg

    www.koianswers.com/discussion/download/13014/RGC Sakai Kohaku 95cm Owned by Felix Denanta.jpg

    Post edited by smoker at 2013-06-01 12:33:08 am
  • HDCuHDCu June 2013
    Posts: 1,117
    In our recent national koi show, there was a very beautiful tancho showa that had a similar defect. This genetic defect was confirmed by the owner, dealer and breeder. Nevertheless she still won the nongosanke GC hands down as judged by the japanese breeder judges. It beat other bigger nongosanke that didnt have any genetic defect.

    This has made me think how many tategois in Japan are kept by breeders because the overall quality outweight such defects. I am sure that as this is considered a compromise, these kois can be purchase at a fraction of its original million yen price yet stand a big chance to win GC in a koi show. Well... maybe not at a fraction but probably just around a few hundred thousand yen instead. Haha.
    Post edited by HDCu at 2013-06-01 10:12:49 am
  • WinlimWinlim June 2013
    Posts: 161
    Definitely B
  • HWONGHWONG June 2013
    Posts: 286
    There are debates about how koi appreciation has changed from the original standards set & if commercial considerations has profoundly changed the landscape.

    The same observations were made in the bodybuilding sport where symmetry and definition was replaced by bulk; the bigger the better. It is a multi billion dollar industry. Some purist are fighting back to restore intergrity of the sport by promoting competitions for drug & steroid free practitioners.

    But in every coin there are 2 sides, you have a choice which playground you want to play in.

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