From: Kick 9/10/00
Subject: Re: this has nothing to do with Betta's. KICK read this please Rose send me an email so I have your address and let me know it is you. Something is going on with the board and to save space, I will just answer you that way if it is okay. Just send to kickpetfish.net and I will get it. We have several things to talk about. Kick
From: Molly- 9/10/00
Subject: Okay kick HOW DO YOU BREED BETTAS? the only reason i am posting like this is because i cant post a new message.
From: Barb 9/09/00
Subject: Betta boys and bubblenesting... I sure feel like writing... need to allow my overwound brain (from too much work) to relax... What's the deal with my betta boys and how they make their bubblenests? Most do a fairly normal job of it. But, I have these 2 guys sitting in my bedroom, kinda' makin' fools out of themselves.Oscar, my very first betta, aka the Amazing Dancing and Jumping Betta; was sort of missing part of his tail when I went back to my office this week after some vacation. He was in my 5 gal tank which never cycled in 2.5 months (now, that's a very LONG story!). He's in antibiotics for tail rot and the tail is already starting to grow back. I put him in a bucket yesterday at work and drove him home with me for the weekend. So now, he has moved from a 5 gallon tank to a one gallon Hex. Happy guy spends all night making a bubblenest which spans 90% of the surface area of the Hex. I have never seen such a wide bubblenest in my life! So, does the smaller space make him think there's a girl in his future *build bubblenest* or is he feeling so much better from his tail growing back (kind of embarrassing to swim around with a stubby tail !) *build more bubblenest* or is he just happy to finally spend the weekend at home with me and not stay in the office in the complete dark *build even more bubblenest*?? He likes to build his bubblenest around the heater in his tank... I guess that he's just thinkin' ahead about making sure that those eggs stay REALLY warm. You guessed it... he's never been a father!Now for my young yellow (and so sweet faced) male... he's just learning bubbles... some are really small and others are just huge!! He blows a really huge one and then looks at it in disbelief. He gets one eye very close to the huge bubble to see what the heck it is that he has just done; and of course, I am on the other side of that bubble and all I can see is his one eye magnified 20 times its' normal size!! Geez... I guess when you are a young betta, this bubble thing doesn't necessarily come naturally, that is, there is some practice involved. On the other hand, I could just have a dorky dude who will never get it quite right.Thanks for the therapy,Barb
From: Carissa 9/10/00
Subject: question about bubble nests... When I look at the top of my bowl, there is a grouping of bubbles (about an inch to 2 inches wide), but I always thought they just sort of massed together on their own from his breathing. Is that a bubble nest? I don't see him "making" it, but I'll look a little closer for a while.
From: Barb 9/10/00
Subject: Re: question about bubble nests... Hi Carissa!If those groupings of bubbles are clustered together, then that is a bubblenest. They can be only one layer thick of bubbles or can be as thick as half an inch or so of bubbles (and that looks like foam). Usually the bubblenest is attached to the side of the bowl or is made around a plant that is sticking above the surface of the water.If the grouping of bubbles is spread out, either your betta wasn't paying much attention and was blowing them out where ever he happened to be or he had built a nest which was disturbed and spread out by a draft. If the opening of the bowl is left open to the air, it can sometimes be difficult for a betta to maintain a nest because of air currents and evaporation.Usual betta breathing doesn't form bubbles on the surface. My guys often make their nests during the middle of the night and on the far side of the bowl which makes it very difficult to notice. If they see you catching them making a nest, they will stop and come and see what it is that you want! So, you should be a little sneaky!Barb
From: Carissa 9/10/00
Subject: thanks! Well, I went in and broke up my poor betta's bubble nest, and he didn't seem very concerned. But I've been watching all day, and he hasn't made any bubbles yet! However, I will look in the morning, because I have a feeling he's doing this on the sly. Come to think of it, none of my female bettas have bubble groupings on their water, so that's what it must be!
From: Barb 9/10/00
Subject: Yea... but females have been known to bubblenest :) n/m
From: Barb 9/10/00
Subject: I don't breed bettas. Molly- Tell me about your bettas and how long you have had them. Are you planning on trying to breed them? Barb
From: Kick 9/10/00
Subject: I know how to breed bettas. Molly, this is a site that will explain fully what you need in order to breed bettas. I am not sure if Petfish has my "article" up yet or not, and I don't have the time to look today to be sure. If you have any questions, post to me. Kickhttp://badman2nd.tripod.com/articles/article11.html
From: Mom2five 9/10/00
Subject: Help! Bad news .... We've lost two more fish in the last 24 hrs. Another neon tetras, and the Rainbow Fish. My pH is at 7.4 this am, and the ammonia is a "strong" .5 - 1 ppm (before it was very weak) -- nearly moving up to the next shade.What should I do? I've been feeding 2Xday (once in AM, once in PM), and they eat it all in about 3 minutes. There's no excess food in the tank. The "orange" fish are swordtails. So, that leaves me with the 2 swordtails, one tetras, and the little white catfish. The catfish is always scurrying around, like he's trying to break out -- is that normal? I turn the lights off every night, is that what I should be doing? The other fish are looking out the front of the tank alot, looking like they're waiting for food, is that normal?I did see the Rainbow and Tetras at the top "gasping" before they dies, so I knew it was coming. What next, Kick?
From: corrado 9/10/00
Subject: Re: Help! Bad news .... I think your ph is no good for neons the ph for neons is(6.0-6.5)your ammonia do 20%water change every weeks t'il it goes (0)after your nitrite suppose to rise up.
From: Kick 9/10/00
Subject: Re: Help! Bad news .... Okay, let's do about a 20 percent water change today. Let the new water circulate for about an hour and then do a reading. Remember I told you that the neons were not hardy fish and have probably succombed to the ammonia of the unestablished tank. Don't get any more of these until you know for sure that your tank has cycyled. You may lose some fish along the way because of the overstocking in the beginning, so lets just be patient for a while. Yes, you do need to turn the lights off in the eve. If when turning them off, the fish scurry and scatter like is scares them to death, this is a good thing to do. Leave lights on in the room so the tank will not be in total darkness. Turn the tank lights off and wait for a little while before turning the room lights off (in the case everyone is ready for bed). This gives the fishies a chance to go from daylight to dark in somewhat of a "natural" day. I can't remember what kind of cat you bought. Do you remember? If it is an oto cat, he may be looking for food. Cories will sometimes do the same thing. As long as it is just "scurrying" and not darting and gasping for breath, I would imagine he is okay. Just make sure that he is getting something to eat. Pieces of algae wafers are sometimes good for bottom feeders if you think they are being outsmarted in the food dept.Whenever you see "gasping" or darting, you know that their water is uncomfortable. This is a good sign that it needs to be changed. Can you tell me what kind of filter you have? There is a product you can buy to put in the filter to reduce high ammonia, and we might want to consider this if the ammonia does not decrease. Let me know. I will keep looking for you. Kick
From: CT 9/10/00
Subject: Re: Help! Bad news .... What I think is happening:You've probably got a problem with untreated or not properly treated tap water. * What are you using the treat your tap water?* You may be using a tap water conditioner that unbinds the chloramine bond but leaves the ammonia. DO NO MORE WATER CHANGES UNTIL YOU GET A HANDLE ON THIS.* Make sure your change water is within plus or minus 2 degrees temperature of your tank water.What to do:* Rush out to the nearest LFS and pick up a bottle of AmQuel (accept no substitutes). Dispense AmQuel at the rate of ten drops per gallon of water (this product can not be overdosed so don't worry if you splash in a little extra by accident). Dose the tank and any change water with AmQuel, now!* Make sure your ammonia test kit is not a Nessler based kit (it will say so on the bottle if it is). You will need a salicylate based kit -- ask your LFS for details.* Add extra aeration with an air pump and air stone.Act fast!CT
From: Donna 9/10/00
Subject: Our tap water is well water... And it does not have chlorine in it, but we used "wardley watercare chlor out" when we started up. LFS is closed, and I am homebound until Monday night.
From: Carissa 9/10/00
Subject: well water... The Wardley stuff takes care of chlorine and chloramines.Well water won't have any chlorine or chloramines in it (I've used it before). But it oftentimes has dissolved metals that can make the water more alkaline.
From: Barb 9/10/00
Subject: Kick and CT... need help! This newbie's thoughts on not having access to Amquel...1. It sounds like poisoning from ammonia is killing your fish. Do you know of any friends or neighbors who have a fish tank? They may be able to give you some Amquel, to detoxify the ammonia, to tide you over until you can get to the LFS. Also, do you know of someone who could drive to a not-so-local fish or pet store to get the Amquel for you as a really big favor?2. I would stop feeding the fish until you hear from Kick or CT. If it is ammonia that is killing your fish, then you want to reduce production of ammonia. If you feed them less or not at all, there will be less fish waste and hence less ammonia. Fish can handle not being fed for a day or two without any problem.3. We need Kick's and CT's advice on how to "naturally" reduce pH if this is possible, to lessen the toxic effects of ammonia. Also, I don't know if there is a "home remedy" for binding ammonia.4. Does your "Wardley Watercare Chlor Out" also remove chloramines? It should say on the bottle.As I said before... I am very new at this, so please wait for Kick or CT to advise you. I think you can safely withhold the feedings for the time being and definitely check around the neighborhood for some Amquel.Good luck!Barb
From: CT 9/10/00
Subject: Well I hope this doesn't sound too harsh:I'm struggling to keep up with "backfilled" facts and if you're a shut in (at least for the day) I fear the worst. You're on well water that may contain any number of things that are not good for fish. You may be using something to treat or soften your water that may not be good for fish. I would have no way of knowing.What we do know is that you have fish deaths and readable ammonia levels. However you do it -- you need to get AmQuel and fast. That's about as far as I can go with this at the moment. Do further futzing with pH or water changes at your own risk -- I cannot recommend them (these things may be the cause of the problem).CT
From: Carissa 9/10/00
Subject: this is a little confusing to follow... Kind of trying to figure out which post came when, but if your ammonia is at or above 0.6, something will probably have to be done to avoid more deaths, easiest thing is a water change which will dilute the ammonia making it less toxic. Do you know the pH of your tap water? I think probably it is the ammonia that is killing neons and not the pH (although lower pH means less toxicity of ammonia). If you leave the ammonia high, you'll probably cycle the tank sooner, but probably lose more fish in the process.
From: Barb 9/10/00
Subject: Out of curiosity... Is this a situation, that if you had pH Down on hand, would you use this on an emergency and temporary basis? I understand that the number one priority is to lock up the ammonia. Wouldn't lowering the pH make the ammonia less toxic (as there is likely more ammonia to come) as well as make a less alkaline environment which Neon Tetras prefer (but not necessarily require)?Barb
From: Mom2five 9/10/00
Subject: Ok, here's what I'm doing... I'm going to look up the cat on those websites you gave me, and figure out what kind. He's just very small and white. When I feed them, he seems to get plenty to eat, but I may pick up those tablets you told me about when DH gets back in town (he left for a 10 day stint starting Friday, so it'll be a while). I'm trying to get a one of the books you mentioned, I looked for one at WalMart...anything about beginning aquariums, but nothing. I thought they'd at least have SOMETHING in the pet section, but no luck. I'm looking online now. Meanwhile, you're my source! Thanks for being willing to help! Hopefully we'll save some of this first group of fish! I've got a call in to DH to tell me where the siphon stuff is, so I can do the water change, when I get that done, I'll email the water pH/ammonia stuff to you.So, let me get this straight...I turn the aquarium light off, say 7pm when I put kiddos to bed -- aquarium is in the living room, so living room lights are on until around 10 - 11pm. That should do it? Also, I'm not sure if I can tell the difference between "scurrying" and "darting", I guess I'll know that all this movement was "darting" if all my fish die. Live and learn (or die and learn, as the case may be...). My filter attaches to the side (not the bottom), beyond that, I don't know how to tell you what "kind" it is Ü. Does my ignorance impress you? Ok, that's all for now, I'll be emailing you as I go. Thanks for holding our hand/fins through this learning curve!!
From: Randy 9/12/00
Subject: Re: Cycling your new tank I just for the first time found this message board. If your tank is still cycling there is a product by seachem which you can purchase that will nutralize the ammonia and the nitrites which will follow the ammonia spike. The product is called prime. It molecularly nuetralizes nitrogeneous products and renders them inert and therefore harmless to the fish. I have cycled a 170 gallon tank with discus using this product and lost not one fish. As a matter of fact I even introduced new fish during the cycle phase and did not lose one of them either. I highly suggest you purchase this product. It should be available at all higher end fish stores. Seachem also has a website with a phone number to contact and they are very helpful in answereing your questions.Randy
From: CT 9/10/00
Subject: Re: Ok, here's what I'm doing... The darting and scurrying is an "escape response". Your fish are running for their lives. Please make the recommended changes detailed in my previous post.CT
From: Kick 9/10/00
Subject: CT: I think I have Mom2five under control CT: Mom2five(Donna) has been emailing me and I hope I have her under control??? She started up a new tank and "listening" to the LPS has once again gotten someone in trouble. She stocked with too many fish to start and neons no less, so we are trying to get the tank settled down and ammonia down with a little too many fish. She is learning, but presently knows very little about keeping a tank, and I am trying via email to take her step by step along the way. I am just afraid all the posts and the mess we are in right now will really confuse her. And from the post above, I just found out she has well water. But I think the main problem of this tank is the initial overstocking and that is why the ammonia is kicking in. The pH is doing what it does in a lot of tanks--good from the tap then slowly rises after in the tank. I told her about the neons not being good starter fish and I am sure the rising pH is not helping. But I hope I have her on the right track. Hope Clint finds us soon. This board is really going to get messy! Kick
From: corrado 9/10/00
Subject: Re: CT: I think I have Mom2five under control like i said i'm prety sure it's a ph problem the neons die first the swordtail and the catfish are ok because thats the good parameters for those fish, overcrowd the tank is not good two Kick make a good point on that.
From: Barb 9/09/00
Subject: Re: betta imbellis Sorry... I have no personnel experience with B.imbellis... but I do find all those different types of Bettas so intriguing. I believe that you are correct in that the imbellis boys and girls can live together in harmony. The last link is to a guy (Irving) who lives in Norway and he is totally into different types of Bettas (and sells them). The only kind of Betta slendens that he has are Wild-type. The site is a little difficult to read (hehe) and I know that he is working on an English version.(http://www.fishbase.org/Photos/PicturesSummary.cfm?ID=12038) Picture of Betta imbellis(http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.cfm?ID=12038&genusname=Betta&speciesname=imbellis) Betta imbellis(http://www.jenssenfiskeimport.cjb.net) Irving's BettasBarb
From: Kick 9/09/00
Subject: Testing, Testing Apparently the section to place new messages has disappeared from my screen. Just want to see if this will post. That could be the problem with no new messages today. See what I can do here.
From: ~deb 9/08/00
Subject: beclyn needs advice... About 2/3 down, beclyn still has a fat cherry barb!~deb
From: Barb 9/09/00
Subject: Re: I added my 0.02 cents below (n/m) Hello CT! How ya' been? OK, enough of the niceties...What's the deal with you only forking over 2/100's of a cent's worth of advice? Splerge a little... give up the whole 2.00 cents worth, OK?Barb
From: Barb 9/11/00
Subject: Re: I'm OK Maybe... but not so cheap that you use old toothbrushes on your aquarium! (Settle down Kitty Fish! I'm just kidding!).I am glad that you are OK. I just sort of noticed a paucity of your usual wit and humor in recent days... you have just sort of been getting down to business and that of course is OK, but not nearly as funny. :) No pressure intended, but I look forward to you cracking me up every day! So, it is good to know that you are all right.I will write you an "unnecessary post", oh, say, about my escapades at Aquarium City, my delight at watching fish parasite movies (I've seen them all !), perhaps what I've been thinking about my new fish disease books or about your "Adding Interest" site; when Kick lifts the moratorium on such posts. She'd like to keep it all Q&A for the time being.Barb
From: CT 9/11/00
Subject: We could all use a frosty beverage! :-) I've been working some hellacious hours lately. Sorry for the limited activity and lack of lightheartedness -- but I'm way beyond tired. The petfish board is really hard to follow right now so look for me a bit more when things get back to "normal". At that time I'll resume posting in the idle hours between 2:00 & 4:00 AM. :-)Let me know if there's something on down the board that I should look at.CT
From: Carissa 9/08/00
Subject: need a betta behavior expert... I have three female bettas, a red one, a purple one, and a scrawny one. The red one I've had for a few weeks, the other two I got last night (got a deal on the scrawny one) So, I put the two new ones in a 2 gal. bucket for the time being. They were in the same tank in the pet shop, and they seemed to get along. Today I decided to put the purple one in with my red one, but to leave the scrawny one out for a while until she gets looking better. So that's what I did. But a couple of minutes after I put her in, I looked in the tank, and the purple and red ones were fighting, the purple one was chasing the red one with her mouth wide open like she was trying to look really big and mean and she was taking nips at the red ones gills, and the red one was all flared up too. I was surprised, because the purple one didn't seem to have a problem with the scrawny one, and when I bought the red one she was in a tank with a bunch of other female bettas too. I don't know who started it, but it looked like the purple one was the instigator from what I could tell (although after I put her in, I noticed that the red one was flaring up her fins a bit, but she wasn't chasing the purple one or biting her at all so I thought she was just excited to see another fish). Anyway, I took the purple one out again and I put her in her own seperate bucket. Then I started wondering why the scrawny one was looking so scrawny after all (since she eats like a pig)....could the purple one have already gotten dominance over the scrawny one by chasing her around until she got sick looking? Or was the red one just mad that someone else was invading her own personal tank? Can't everyone all just get along?