Topic: Am I doing this right?

[Jessie226]

hi everyone. This is my first spawn, as some of you may know. I just wanted to let you all know how I am caring for them and ask if I should be doing anything differently. They seem awful small to me for being 11 weeks old, but again this is my first spawn so I really have nothing to compare it to. Right now I've got 12 males jarred, and four left in the grow-out tank, though I think I am going to jar them up too because the water is getting cloudy and I don't know why, but I don't want them getting sick. They are being fed about 4 or 5 frozen blood worms each twice a day along with some bbs twice a day, and they get a mid-day snack of microworms once a day. I am doing 75% water changes in the jars about every two days, and syphon from the bottom to get all the gunk. They eat until they look ready to burst and there is never any uneaten food. Should I feed them more? Am I feeding enough of a variety? Should I keep the jars away from each other? They are all very aggressive and flair like crazy which makes telling the males from the females very difficult. None have ovipositors yet, they ALL flair and they ALL display vertical bars when excited. I think they're hermaphrodites.  
I think that's about it. I am waiting for my MG CT's to come in the mail from Thailand, they should come today or tomorrow. They're going to be my next spawn. I've got their tanks all set up, a 2.5 gallon with a submersable heater, a bunch of floating live plants and about 4 inches of water, and of course a glass lid and divider. I am going to put the male on his side right away but am going to keep the female seperate for a day so the male can get used to his new quarters. I plan on putting her in with him tomorrow and if all goes well, taking the divider out on Friday.
Ok thanks for any tips and advise you can give me! :-) And wish me luck! This pair cost a pretty penny so I am really hoping for some action!
Sorry for the lengthness of this post...

[Butterfly]

Sounds like you're doing everything right to me for the spawning process.

I'd wait however, before I bred the halfmoons though. If you're getting them today or tomorrow, then you should wait at least a month to breed them. It's a long trip from Thailand and from Transshiper to you, and they're both going to be stressed. Putting them together that quickly and expecting them to breed while still very stressed is not a good idea. One or the other can become sick and chances are likely that they won't even spawn at all. Put them in separate tanks for a month or so so they can get good adn used to their new home with you, then try to breed them. It's the safest bet for them right now.

[dorn27]

I agree with the above advice.  Failing to wait a month, will mean a failed breeding attempt and very high stress.  You wouldn't want to stress your new fish to death.

Sounds to me like the fry are being properly cared for.  You could keep the jars together (for space reasons) if you place a piece of white paper between the jars.

Also do you test the water in the jars?  I think you might need to do daily changes of 75%.  However it will depend on the test results.  If you have ammonia on day two, you should be changing the water daily so they are not exposed to ammonia. It will help their growth too. Once they grow a bit bigger and stronger, then you'll want to do 100% changes so that you don't get a build up of ammonia.

[Butterfly]

From the size of the jars, I'd just do daily or every other day 100% water changes. Doing a 75% wouldn't take out all of the bad stuff and would encourage it to cycle - andthat's not good for the wee little babies.

[Jessie226]

Thanks everyone! :-) My first spawning were pet shop fish and I spawned them within a week of having them, but I hadn't considered the stress they'll be under after all that traveling so I will wait. :-) And they're Crowntails btw, not halfmoons.
I don't test the water every day, but I will start. Last I checked was over the weekend and everything was perfect. I use only aged treated water. I use Cycle and Stress Coat to treat the water.
The MG's tanks are all set up and waiting for them. I am not going to put them in the same container at first, not only for stress reasons but for quarantine reasons, if one is sick I don't want the other to get it.
Butterfly, I don't understand why encouraging cycling would be bad for the fry?
Thanks again everyone for all your help! You've been extremely helpful!

[Butterfly]

Bettas, though very hardy fish, don't do well when being put through a cycle - especially fry which are so fragile. Because of the ammonia buildup when cycling, bettas tails can become ragged, then can get sick very easily and the ammonia can scar their gills. Since your fry are still small, their labarynth organ is still growing, so you don't want a buildup of ammonia because of cycling to ruin the organ, it's what they need to survive.

It's always advised around here that if you're putting abetta in a cycled tank to make sure it's well cyclend and established before you even think of putting him/her in because of the delicate fins and such.

[dorn27]

A finished cycle is great, but the process of establishing one is bad.  By doing less that 100% changes ammonia builds up, but because the changes are still pretty large, it hold the cycle in limbo.  Increasing ammonia, but not bacteria.  To cycle, you need a filter were bacteria can be housed and grow, jars won't have this. SO you must do 100% changes when ammonia is present.  Amounts as low as .25 change damage their developing organs and finage.

It's basically like this (I know your numbers won't be exactly like this, but this is an easy example to show build up). If you only change 50% of the water, 50% is still left and is likely saturated with ammonia.  If you had a reading of 1ppm, you still have a reading of .5 after a water change.  Then you add a weeks worth (1ppm) to that .5 and you get 1.5ppm with 50% change you get about .75 left on week 2. Then by week three you have 1.75ppm, with a 50% change bringing it down to .88.  The next week the total after a water change would be .94!  In only a month it has built to be almost 1ppm!  The line I consider deadly to fish.  

Changing 75% every other day will delay the process greatly, but will likely still expose the fry to trace amounts.  I would do daily 75% changes for the next week (as long as the ammonia tests 0 daily.) Doing them daily will greatly reduce build up, but still won't eliminate it completely.  With another week under their belt, those fry should be okay with 100% changes as long as the water is aged and the same temperature they were in previously.

[Jessie226]

I totally get you. And I am kicking myself for not knowing this, as I had done all the research months ago. I just didn't put two and two together. :-P My grow out tank cycled for about a month with a sponge filter and lots of live plants before I put the fry in when they were a month old. When I do start 100% water changes, would it be better to do them every day, or every other day?
Thanks again for all the help!!

[dorn27]

It's going to depend on ammonia levels.  If the ammonia doesn't build until day 3, then you can do changes on day 2 (or every other day).  If ammonia is present by the 2nd day, you need to do them everyday.  This way they are never exposed to ammonia, since you change the water before it gets started.

In the begining you might get away with every other day (but every case is different thats why you need to test), but as they grow they'll definitely need daily 100%.

[Jessie226]

I gotcha.   Thanks!!